The twenty year mark just seems so recent as motorcycle design plateaued some time ago. The KLR 650 was unchanged from 1987-2007. For vintage I'd go with Justice Stewart; "I Know It When I See It". If a bike can be competitive in by modern standards it's just not vintage to me, for example a 2001 YZ or KTM ect. Of course if you're trying to get parts for that KTM it might feel vintage.

I really hear Mark on the cars too, my first car in '98 was a '65 Chevy Corvair, no power steering, no air conditioning, no cruise control, no power brakes, carbs, drum brakes with lap belts up front and no seat belts for the rear, it felt rustic. Does my 2000 Tundra feel rustic compared to a 2022 Tundra? Not really.

Hey Darin,

I think we can all agree with the car analogy.

I kind of believe the magic button is what really changed things.

Not rally sure what year magic buttons took over, but you could almost say, if it's kickstart only, it's Vintage ?

Kind of like a cassette player in a Car ?

Can we all agree Cassette players are Vintage ?

---

Cassette Decks No Longer Available in New Vehicles "The end of an era is over. No longer will you be able to your Duran Duran tape while cruising down the road.
It’s finally happened – automakers have stopped putting cassette players in new vehicles.The last new car to be factory-equipped with a cassette deck in the dashboard was the 2010 Lexus SC430.
It’s time has finally come, and besides, if anyone still carries tapes in their cars, please raise your hand."
 

Magic button is hard to say as even the '69 AT 125 had it. I'm no fount of knowledge as I've only been riding a handful of years, but it seems like the late 70s through 80s is when off-road bikes changed dramatically, from metal side panels to plastics and long travel. A good rider on a 90s YZ 125 can put down track times just a few seconds off a new bike, same can't be said for the 70s and early 80s bikes as they just don't have the suspension or engine technology for the speed, regardless of the rider.

Pre 1949….

So my 1980 Les Paul is vintage!! No, I don't think I'd go there..
  I'm almost going to settle in the camp where metal meets plastic... And points meets CDI.. There is "THAT" area that separates stuff.. I'm not bragging either side up.. Something happened through that era.. Wasn't it 1970 my Firebird (the ugliest one made) came out with a pointed rubber nose? .. OR.. even draw the line where the ash trays were pulled out of the cars?  
   Cassette eating radio's.. rather, the new onset of tomorrow... The CD player!! When, in its infancy, did they show up? 
You'll probably get as many answers as there are members here... Great conversation...
Sneezles61

I think it's all in the eye of the beholder. My youngest boy who is 35 has started to pick up a few rides from his younger days. A 2-stroke Honda 250 three wheeler and a KX250. Not sure the exact years, but to him, they are vintage.

Common Definitions of the Term Vintage

When comparing antique vs vintage pieces, the definition of vintage is more subjective than the meaning of an antique. There is a primary definition of vintage:

Primary Definition of Vintage

Merriam Webster states, the primary definition of vintage has nothing to do with furniture or collectibles. The term vintage actually pertains to wine and is an altered form of the French word vendage. Taken literally, vendage means “the grapes that were picked in a certain season.”

So, strictly speaking, the term vintage refers to something that occurred last season.

Vintage, as an adjective means “characterized by excellence, maturity and enduring appeal; classic.”

But it also says it can mean “old-fashioned or obsolete”.

As well as, “being the best of its kind; choice”, or “of, imitating, or being a style or fashion of the past, retro”.

Vintage, then, is a bit trickier to define.

Generally speaking, most agree that it refers to an object that has age (at least 20 years) and speaks of a certain era or time period.

The age stipulation of at least 20 years has been a real focus as of late, because of online sales and the rules of description enforced by sites like Ebay for example.

You cannot list an item as “Vintage” if it was manufactured less than 20 years ago.

So, lets get some "old-fashioned or obsolete" 20 year old+ motorcycles out of the garage and ride them at 'Vintage' Dual Sport events ?

 

I'm sure there are at least a few newer bikes that are identical in features to the same model of a 20 year old bike...  so you want to exclude someone because what they have is not old enough?

I guess I just don't get why you're trying so hard to define what type of bike is "allowed" to attend a ride?  Drum or disc...  twin shock...  no electric start?  (maybe until it was mentioned one of the first Yamaha Enduros had electric start).

Why not concentrate on route and terrain?  Put together something that is fun and suitable for the older machines...  being honest about what capabilities the machine needs to have.  (An AT1 is a great bike but maybe not the best choice for high altitude climbs or higher speeds.)   And by that I mean actually take an old bike out on the trail with an average rider and map out a fun route and keep the terrain speeds suitable for older bikes with less suspension.

Cater your event to the older machines...  but who cares if someone wants to show up on something newer as long as they are having fun?  It's not a race. 

And the funny part is I've gone on some challenging trails with local groups riding mostly new orange bikes...  when the going gets slower the lower seat height and less power of an older bike become a definite advantage...  it's kinda fun to have to wait for or even hike back to help guys that were scoffing at your bike before the start of the ride. 

On the high speed sections there's just no keeping up with those guys though. 




 

MarkT nailed it !!! I could tell you stories about the same thing in the Mustang world it really doesn’t matter at the end of the day have FUN 

In terms of dirt bikes when I hear someone say "I have a vintage dirt bike" I automatically picture a mid 60's or 70's bike. Lol. Definitely for me though I say anything about pre 85 or maybe a few years earlier is vintage. Late 80's not so much and certainly not anything 90's forward for me.